Senator the Hon Michaelia Cash
Shadow Minister for Foreign Affairs
Leader of the Opposition in the Senate
Senator for Western Australia

TRANSCRIPT

Sky News with Laura Jayes

12 August 2025

Topics: Palestinian recognition

E&OE

Laura Jayes

Let’s bring in Shadow Foreign Affairs Minister, Michaelia Cash, who joins me bright and early. Thanks so much for your time, Michaelia, appreciate it. 140 nations, including our AUKUS partner, the UK has recognized Palestine, albeit with some caveats. What’s wrong with Australia doing the same?

Senator Cash

Well, let’s be very clear, Mr. Albanese yesterday in recognizing a Palestinian state while terrorists still control Gaza, has basically rewarded terrorism. That is completely, totally and utterly unacceptable…… (interrupted)

Laura Jayes

Michaelia can I just … on that issue that Hamas still completely control Gaza. But this has happened as Israel has now announced a full takeover of the Gaza Strip. So does Hamas at this point in time control Gaza?

Senator Cash

At this point in time, yes, they do. But let’s also be clear that this is now unconditional recognition. Penny Wong has confirmed that. Anthony Albanese has confirmed that. In other words, none of the conditions that Mr. Albanese and Penny Wong had been talking about all of this year need to be met. That is an outrageous position to be in. In particular, they have not demanded the release of the hostages. I mean, Hamas have been very clear, they have welcomed other countries recognizing a Palestinian state. And you know what they’ve said, this is a fruit of October the seventh. So it is reckless, it is disappointing. But more than that, it does nothing to change the situation on the ground for the Palestinian people.

Laura Jayes

What is your position? Then? What is the coalition’s position on foreign policy when it comes to Israel, Gaza and recognizing Palestine?

Senator Cash

Well, we have been very, very clear. We remain committed to a two-state solution. In the first instance, Hamas must release the hostages. Secondly, Hamas must be removed from controlling the Gaza Strip, and thirdly, genuine peace negotiations need to be entered into by both parties. But what Mr. Albanese did yesterday, and I saw today, Laura it was quite a bizarre press conference. Mr. Albanese was trying to say that the decision yesterday would somehow isolate Hamas. Mr. Albanese has got to be kidding himself. Hamas effectively control the Gaza Strip. Hamas will not see the decision…….. (interrupted)

Laura Jayes

Michaelia, I don’t see how We’ve just seen Benjamin Netanyahu announce a full takeover of Gaza.

Senator Cash

But that has not commenced

Laura Jayes

Yeah, but it does look like a carpark. We see two million people displaced. How much control does Hamas really have? They have political control. They’re controlling the propaganda message. But what are we talking about here? Because when you talk about your solution here, a political solution and recognizing Palestine, it’s still unclear where the lines are.

Senator Cash

When you say where the lines are, that’s a question that also Mr. Albanese now needs to answer, because what has he actually recognized. There is no state in existence. You normally recognize a state when it is in existence. So Mr. Albanese has made a statement recognizing a state without borders… (interrupted)

Laura Jayes

So would the Coalition wait for what? A full takeover from Israel.

Senator Cash

We’ve been very clear takeover recognition…. (interrupted) Just hold on for two seconds. Recognition needs to come at the end of the peace process, we have been very clear about that. In the first instance, the hostages must be released. I am very surprised that Mr. Albanese has gone ahead with symbolic recognition, because that’s all it is. Ultimately, there is no state to recognize. But he has not demanded from Hamas the release of the hostages. Laura, you and I both know Hamas could actually end this war tomorrow. It could stop the suffering of the civilians in Gaza if it released the hostages and laid down its arms. The question that Mr. Albanese needs to answer is this – how does Mr. Albanese’s announcement yesterday, take any steps towards the release of the hostages and Hamas ultimately laying down at its arms and surrendering.

Laura Jayes

What was the status quo doing to release the hostages? I would argue, not much either.

Senator Cash

Well, again, recognizing a Palestinian state does nothing more and nothing less than embolden terrorism. Marco Rubio was very, very clear. He’s been, as you know, involved directly in the cease fire negotiations. When President Macron of France stood up and announced that France would be recognizing a Palestinian state, that is when Hamas basically walked away from the cease fire negotiations that were underway. So you have direct evidence that shows taking steps by countries to recognize a Palestinian state while Hamas a terrorist group is in control, does nothing to affect what we all ultimately want, Laura and that is peace. That’s what we all want, peace. But you do not get peace. – let’s be very, very clear…. (interrupted)

Laura Jayes

Do you support a full takeover from Netanyahu of the Gaza Strip? Is that the pathway to peace?

Senator Cash

I’ve been very clear in my comments – that is a decision that is an operational and military tactical decision for the Israeli government on the ground…. (interrupted)

Laura Jayes

Michaelia that’s a political decision. You know how politically charged that decision would be. Do you accept that part of the reason that these countries, 140 of them, have used this their positions to recognize the state of Palestine is because of Netanyahu perceived or actual overreach Do you does the Coalition endorse everything that Netanyahu has done? How do you diverge from any of his positions?

Senator Cash

Let’s be very clear in the first instance, I have always said on behalf of the Coalition that all parties, including Israel, must comply with international law…. (interrupted)

Laura Jayes

Do you think that is happening?

Senator Cash

That’s an absolute given – if there are allegations or incidents where people are saying that this did not occur, they should be investigated absolutely by the appropriate bodies? But when you look at how this started on October the seventh, 2023 Hamas launched a massive terrorism offensive on Israel. It butchered and slaughtered 1200 Israelis, and it took hostages, many of whom still remain in the tunnels today. It is also a fact Laura that at law, Israel has the right to self-defence…. (interrupted)

Laura Jayes

I agree with that but how do you explain the death of 19,000 children in Gaza, it’s a question of proportionality…

Senator Cash

Let me be very clear again. Israel must, at all times act in accordance with international law as Hamas must. But Hamas doesn’t care. International law, Laura, does not apply to terrorists. And as I’ve said, if there is credible evidence that in that international law has been breached, of course, we support that being investigated. But at the same time, Laura, I am not going to move away from the basic fundamental premise of international law that a country does have the right to defend itself, and Israel is doing that based on what occurred on October the seventh, 2023, but please don’t put words in my mouth. I have been very clear. International law must be adhered to. If it is not, it should be investigated.

Laura Jayes

Do you think Netanyahu has overreached here. Or do you support every move he’s made?

Senator Cash

Look the mere fact that we support Israel’s right to defend itself does not mean that we support every decision by Benjamin Netanyahu. But ultimately, as I said, we’re sitting here, we’re sitting here back in Australia, running live commentary on what is going on on the ground in Israel. The decision that Benjamin Netanyahu has made is an operational and tactical one. I think he needs to be very, very clear with the world, what is his end game here? Because he needs to ensure that he is bringing the world with him. And you can see at this point in time he is not. But if I go back to fundamental Laura, basic principles – on October the seventh, 2023 a terrorist organization dedicated to the destruction of Israel, launched a terrorist attack – one of the worst we have seen in history since the Holocaust. At international law, Israel has the right to self-defence. Though, in saying that that right must be exercised in accordance with international law. But do not ask me, Laura, to sit here and make excuses for terrorists who are dedicated to the destruction of Israel, because I can tell you right now, I will not do that.

Laura Jayes

Michaelia Cash, always appreciate your time, especially from Perth this early.

Senator Cash

Great to be with you.